Metal Reviews

Anybody that has the gall to say Slayer is black metal has zero credility on the subject.
Same goes for Cradle of Filth.
Get the fuck outta here with that shit.

This.

This is an iffy subject and one that I am quite at odds with, on one hand you have the band that was indeed darker than other English acts, but it would be Celtic Frost, Bathory, Root and other bands that took Venom's formula further.

That's actually true, whereas Hellhammer were IMO a little bit more black metal than Celtic Frost who went more in the doom/death direction (and came back to satanism with Monotheist and then Triptykons current album).

But hell (lol), even today Venom praising themselves as black metal:

http://www.venomslegions.com/

EDIT: And my point is, if Venom are black metal, then Dimmu Borgir are even more.

I'm not saying Slayer IS, but they were a part of the first wave, because they used the same image as the european bands like Venom, Hellhammer and so on.

WTF Venom are nothing but a thrash band with Satanic lyrics nothing more. To call them black metal is ridiculous in itself

And also Mercyful Fate help start the black metal movement too are they black metal as well

How can a band not be black metal when they have songs and albums like this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fHmzFVDjVnM

The first wave is different to the second. In 1983 was no Darkthrone, Emperor, Mayhem (whereas I don't know exactly, because they are very old). Venom, Hellhammer, Sodom, Slayer, Kreator, Destruction or Mercyful Fate were with the most extreme bands back then. Or not? Is Sodom - Blasphemer not very extreme Metal? : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jrBAaosod4Q

and funny thing is that the lyrics are:

"Black metal is the game I play
'cause no one show me the right way
I am a bloody Antichrist, only believe in bad
Spit at the church, Evil I get"

Yes the music is basically thrash/heavy/doom metal with satanic lyrics. But that's the very definition of early Black Metal. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OWPfNVAS ... re=related ( I hope you can hear the music, because in my country it's muted)

I looked back through your post history. You instigated a similar argument less than a year ago. Indeed, it was with V. In fact, it seems like this is your favorite topic...that and thrash. Furthermore, it appears you really don't talk ( or know?) much of anything concerning black metal past the first wave.

I understand why some of you thrash types are deadset about claiming black metal owes everything to thrash, or how black metal is just bastardized thrash, but really...it sounds like you've listened to maybe 5 post-first wave acts a few times and yet think you are the gospel of truth on the genre.

I have never claimed to have anything beyond a cursory knowledge of thrash, and I wouldn't dare try to lecture someone like Devoted Walnut or the Voice (or pick your thrash head) on the definition of the genre.

This discussion has gone from amusing to abominable.

Actually I know many black metal albums which came out after the first wave. E.G. Darkthrone A Blaze in the Northern Sky, Under a Funeral Moon, Transylvanian Hunger, Panzerfaust, Total Death, Hate Them, Plaguewielder, Ravishing Grimness, Sardonic Wrath (actually I have all albums as mp3 )... or Emperor In the Nightside Eclipse, Anthems..., IX Equilibrium, Prometheus... or Watain Sworn to the Dark, Lawless Darkness, Satyricon Diabolical Now, Age of Nero, Dark Medieval Times, Gorgoroth Quantos Possunt Ad Satanitatem Trahunt, Dark Fortress Ylem, Desaster 666 Satan's Soldiers Syndicate (ok it's more black thrash), Sonic Reign Raw Dark Pure, Abigor Fractal Possession, Dissection Storm of the Light's Bane, Immortal All Shall Fall and naturally all Dimmu Borgir and COF albums.

Maybe that's not many, but I know how the second wave is different to the first. But that does not say, that the first wave is not more bm, only because the second is different.

And I think I was not the first here in this thread who said that Dimmu Borgir are not BM.

And I also think that many claim that DB are not BM not because of the music, but more of the image and success of the band. It's the same with COF.

Naturally.

Emperor Black N'Doom has a point, though - this would be like me lecturing metalNESS on power metal or noodles lecturing anyone on anything. There's an etiquette to it, y'hear?

WHO CARES

This type of discussion was made on the MA forum a while back, and while I know none of you are daft enough to question Venom's influence (as our friends from MA), I learned from that conversation that the roots of the music go very deep. I don't think that it's solely thrash that determined the music, though the case could be made for very early Mayhem, bands like Root, Mercyful fate, as well as a slew of lesser known acts from Sarcofago to Sabbat of Japan, make for a far more complex picture.

You mean like this?




or this?




Hypocrisy much?

You make a claim such as the one above, in absolute terms, based on an admitted ignorance as to what constitutes that (in your mind) fact.


And yet... when one states the opposite opinion, complete with reasoning, they are arrogant and disrepectful pricks...



Very interesting.

Are you so sad that I left the topic that you have to dig in older posts so to bring me back in.
Not a chance... You're the kind of person to never let go of an argument, not me.

"Digging up older posts"?
They are a day or two back.
I guess to some no-life sloping forehead simian that makes twenty posts a day, it seems like "older" posts...

you're the dipshit that decided to step on my toes, I exposed your bullshit for what it is.
I don't let shit that just pass without redress.
If you don't can't, or won't, see it through 'til the jobs done, think before hitting the "enter" key next time, Manwich.
Now.. why don't you just fuck off back to whatever slimy little rock you crawled out from under.

Fuck you.

This is turning into a rap battle.