Metal Reviews

I dont think their views are opposed at all, i dont see where is it that Bruce takes a possitive stand against downloading he practicaly says that downloading hasnt affected Iron Maiden that much wich is a fact, Gene is just stating his opinion.

Bullshit, Gene.

Maiden are still releasing records. Priest are still releasing records. Megadeth are still releasing records. And they're doing just fine.

And new metal bands, like Kamelot, Bodom, Sonata Arctica? They're doing just fine too.

You can understand hoe Gene Simmons is a dinosaur with his thoughts stuck in the 80s when he says "there isn't a chance for a new band to become the next BEATLES or KISS". That's absolutely RIGHT, but who said that's BAD?

Today the musical diversity that reach our ears is a billion times bigger than 2 or 3 decades ago. That's why Bruce said music is getting more democratic and competitive. Because now you can choose from literally HUNDREDS of bands. And if two decades ago, 10 million people liked ONE band, now its like the same 10 million people got divided into groups of 50 thousand fans who love 20 different bands. HOW IN HELL IS THIS BAD FOR MUSIC? FOR CULTURE? It only means that artists wont get multi-billionaires with private jets and bathing with Evian water or something. Now bands will still be rich (when they're good), but the target audience WILL be smaller. Like Bruce said, more democratic and competitive.

That's funny, I was reading Vision Divine interviews today and got the distinct impression from their comments that they want their music heard and appreciated more than anything because they love playing music. Are there comments inconsequential because they aren't doin' it for the money? My guess is that you are using circular logic that only those against downloading have a say in the issue.

Most of these bands in the metal scene don't give a fuck because they record their own music and play a lot of shows. Back when I had some money I bought extra copies of VD's albums so when the time came I could download the next album until I could afford to buy a copy. That's how much I like them.

Maiden, Priest, and Megadeth are people who really love making music and will continue to do so.

Gene Simmons and KISS love women more than their music and they're just plain lazy to record any new material.

Nice to know he isn't just in it for the money. Without a music industry, there is no music? Wtf. I thought KISS were supposed to have a legion of devoted fans who would buy whatever fucking shit they put their logo on? Talk about throwing your toys out of the KISS-brand pram.



Unfortunately the "he's rich so his opinion doesn't matter" argument can be spun both ways. You have much more disposable income to spend on cds than a lot of people that download more music than they buy. Yet you consider yourself to be in a position to criticize them for doing so. Downloading doesn't have as negative an effect on IM's finances as it does on SM's finances, therefore SM are more qualified to talk about it. Buying albums doesn't have as negative an effect on your finances as it does on some teenager's, therefore the latter is more qualified to judge the morality of downloading music.

I actually kind of agree with you, but am playing devil's advocate.

The way I see all this stuff is like a scale. Downloading haves it's upsides and downsides. One of the upsides is that free downloading brings music to the masses, actually more people hears the music (many people won't buy cd if they're not sure about the band. Well I buy cd only if it's a true classic of it's genre and never "better" albums of some bands) as I said before by downloading more people gets to hear the album and a band which means more crowd on a concerts. I belive that metal will get stronger with free downloading because more people will hear it (If you ask any metalhead in my town everybody will say that they got to metal over the internet and downloading, that includes me; actually I first time heard metal when I was like 9 and found some my mom's records and there were Iron Maiden, Motorhead and Deep Purple, and what I did when I heard it I liked it and same minute went in my room and started downloading)
So I think downloading is a good thing because fans will then buy merchandise go on concerts. Or even better then will studio bands be exterminated, how? like this... then bands would have to have good live shows, because some bands suck live you won't go to see them and if it rules you will travel whole continent just to see them because it's worth it. So my final conclusion is this I find downloading a good thing and if someone says that because some bands won't get rich well... metal ain't about getting rich, metal is about the music!

Thats the difference between Maiden and Kiss; Maiden ( and many other bands) play because they love it and would do it regardless of becoming rich (probably).
Making music for the sake of making music.
Kiss was always about a marketable gimmick. They even went disco, for fucksake.
Didn't this arrogant prick go after King Diamond because of the face-paint? And also claim the rights to the horns? Assclown...
Hey Eugene, Alice Cooper did it before you, did ya know that?
Anyway, Kiss haven't done anything worth a pisshole in the snow since around 1975.
Fuck off, Eugene. I am going to download all of Kiss's albums and never listen to them, just because I'm a spiteful bastard that doesn't like greedy crass crappy merchandise-peddling belligerent swine.


Downloading is the modern day high tech version of what we did back in the day: tape trading.
Without tape trading, Metal would have been drastically less known, and who knows what we would have today.
Especially since Metal has always been a working class venue.
If I want to share my album collection with someone who conversely wants to share theirs with me, that is our business; we paid for the albums already, and I'll make as many copies as I choose. It's not as if we are profiting off of it monetarily.

Exactly;
This especcialy applies to underground BM; they are not in it for the money, they don't even tour most of the time.
Art for art's sake.
Still, nothing beats the tangible product, and when ever possible I will seek it out.

How are CoB, Sonata Artica or Kamelot new bands? They've been around for years!

And it's hard to say what new releases are metal classics. You can predict them - > Mayhem - Ordo and Rotting Christ - Theogonia, but a Metal Classic like Rust In Peace?

It's also hard that the only anti-downloading bigwigs that admit it are the likes of Gene Simmons.

Napster was created in 1999, and people were already downloading mp3 like crazy before that. So ... these 3 bands (and so many others) were born in a time where mp3 trading was already a big thing ... and they're doing just fine. None of them will become as big as the likes of Iron Maiden, Judas Priest or Metallica, but they all can get their load of fans, CD and DVD sales, shows ... and get rich too.

yeah fuck bruce dickinson and iron maiden for working hard and making great music for 25+ years while still retaining a great relationship with their fans!

Well put!!

stuff by Opeth, Children of Bodom, Meshuggah, Mastodon, Agalloch, etc will be looked back on as classics. Kinda hard to guess what will be a classic until later.


They all formed before the downloading thing started but I think they've all become popular in the last 5 or so years.

I've been DLing CoB since 2000... Along with numerous others.

They seem to be doing alright.

That is what pisses people off right there. I enjoy downloading, but what you do is not doing the right thing whatsoever. You are ripping CoB off because you are obviously enjoying their work and simply don't pay for it.

There is no buy xxx amount get xxx free kind of deal. Sipport the bands you like or don't listen to them.

It's one thing to test drive a car 5 times a month in the hopes of buying it, it's another thing to drive off the lot with it.

There is no excuse for outright not buying music. Those of us that pay our dues and buy as much as we can and download in addition to that to check out what to buy next are in a little bit of a different situation. The people that call people like me thieves are just as short sighted and uninterested in the bottom line or what we do for music.

You have no obligation to buy a shit album that you wont listen to. On that same note when you use that approach you have the responsibility to buy what you do like.

Contributing nothing to music and being a leech is entirely a different matter and I hope people are realizing that with all these threads and posts about downloading.

Couldn't agree more.

Support is the most important thing a band needs, no matter what. And the best way to support is to buy their stuff. I'm sure most bands appreciate it when the fans buy their music, not to make money, but as a form of appreciation to the hard work the band put in for the record.

I forgot I own 4 CoB albums and 2 T Shirts, and I'm going to be paying to see them live at Gigantour in April.

Surprisingly enough, the downloaded material lead me into being a fan and... This may be a shock... Buying their albums and merch in support.

Hope that makes you feel better.

First off, I can't believe anyone is taking Gene or Bruce seriously. These are two of the last guys I would take advice from on anything...

Bands like Maiden and KISS are not the ones affected by the downloading - it's the smaller bands that will ultimately pay the price. The smaller record companies that bring you alot of the metal you listen to - examples: Katagory V, Brainstorm, Pyramaze - will find it very hard to stay in business when illegal downloading takes sales away. Downloading may turn some new users on to the music, but there are always those that download without purchasing it and that is a lost sale for the record company.

It is smaller companies that sign many of the good quality metal we listen to today, and they will find it hard to stay in business, as they will not be able to afford signing smaller bands. In turn that means less metal music for us.

Also, while bands like Maiden make a lot of money touring, most of the smaller bands don't. Merchandising for them is also a very small amount of income. If they are going to continue to make music, they need to rely on the smaller record companies funding them to record.

Gene is right - downloading is illegal - there is no way to justify it. You have stolen music from the artist that you have not paid for. If you want to sample the music, you have many options now - MySpace and band websites for one. Alot of online record shops (The End Records, CDUniverse, Amazon for example) all offer streams of many albums now. You can listen online before making a choice to purchase. I agree $18 is alot to pay for a crap CD, but downloading it illegally (without paying for the download) is not a legal way to sample.

Unless smaller record labels can find another way to make money off of downloading, we may find that we have far fewer choices for metal other than the crap the major lables throw at us...

Sources? It seems to me if anything that smaller labels have had greater success with the advent of downloading than before, where the only method of hearing underground music was by buying a CD or going to a live show blind (rare for most people), or through a friend or family member. In any case, enough speculation. Lets cite studies, from Harvard!

http://www.unc.edu/~cigar/papers/FileSh ... ch2004.pdf

This study concludes quite interestingly that, and I quote:

- Page 24

Now, they do conclude that album sales of less popular bands with few sails will decrease, though a statistically insignificant amount- however, the study also concludes that this is unlikely to affect either record production or the livelihood of the artists, as only popular artists profit from royalties on record sales. In any case, check the whole thing out- the main text is only 25 pages long, and its quite interesting.



Can this argument be permanently retired? Here in Canada and other countries, downloading is not illegal. Therefore, this is a more complex argument than "the law says so, so its wrong." The law, in this case, is irrelevant to the morality of downloading.

Unless smaller record labels can find another way to make money off of downloading, we may find that we have far fewer choices for metal other than the crap the major lables throw at us...[/quote]