Metal Reviews

The burning mosques in a European country idea is the most fascinating thing in this thread. The Danish cartoon depiction of The Prophet set off such a controversy, imagine what a firestorm this would set off? What would happen? If a "black metal" edge of society group claimed responsibility, would the European secular government cave in to international pressure and crackdown on the group and groups like it? Most likely.

It would be an incredibly ballsy move for a bullied European government to finally put its foot down and dare the Islamofascists to bomb their country. This full-blown clash of cultures seems pretty inevitable these days; we are a far way away from Moorish Spain when Christians, Jews, and Muslims got along quite well, all things considered.

I'm not saying that arson is the best way to change the world, but i respect people who go to such lengths for their cause (even better if i support that cause myself.)

That was when the Islam was a moderate (indeed, philosophically the most advanced) religion, free from fundamentalist tendencies.

Covert government funding for a sort of autochthonic terrorist faction designed specifically to raze mosques would be cool. And if the muslim community dare react in kind, immediate and forceful repatriation would be nice.

And I'm a liberal

The trouble with religion isn't the fact that people choose to believe in a god(s), however daft the rest of us might find it. The trouble is the doctrine, which certain people take to mean the persecution of homosexuals, non-Muslims etc. Although it's a very obvious point that more death has been caused by religion than anything else (and Hitler WAS a Catholic, despite his Occult dabblings. The Vatican never rescinded his Catholic status. Stalin was bought up and groomed for Georgian monkhood, the fact that he later claimed Atheism under his regime doesn't mean he was so. Atheism to me is the absense of belief in ALL gods, including yourself, which makes Fascism, or self-worship taken to an extreme, the worst type of religion. Ditto for Mao, although I'll admit that he wasn't a Catholic ).

Burning churches, mosques, etc will not cause these doctrines to be weakened, au contraire. The only way to deal with religion is to mock it, and all the christrapery stuff is fine in my eyes, esp. with the freedom of expression. Should people make anti-Islam BM? Why not? It's being hypocritical if it doesn't attack, say, Hinduism and Judaism as well as Christianity, as long as getting violent is never an option. Focusing solely on one religion smacks of something wrong, whether Judaism, Islam, or Christianity (although the last is quite acceptable now).

It is stupid to blame the majority of current christians, say, for massacring pagans hundreds of years ago, as stupid as modern Jews refusing to buy German goods. Hatred of a single group/race/religion or whatever borders on fascism, and whilst it's perfectly acceptable to question these religions and doctrines, physical violence is wrong. I've been chased by cuntish Muslims and been helped by decent ones, you can't generalise.

Unless you're saying "more people have been killed by religious people than non-religious people" (which is basically a given), then I don't think the fact that Hitler and Stalin were associated with a religion means that their genocides were religiously inspired...

I think the main problem with religion is that humans believe in it, and we like to kill, subvert, abuse and think we're better than others at every possible oppurtunity.

agreed. Thats what i kinda was saying earlier.

I don't have any delusions of religious organizations weakening by burning places of worship. That's not the point.



What is burning a church other than mocking religion with deeds? Burning a church sends the same message as singing antichristian lyrics, although in a much more concrete way. It won't weaken the religion, but it's a strong provocation.

As for all the "christraping" anti-christian imagery in art, i'm getting pretty damn tired of it. Some bands, like Grand Belial's Key and Profanatica/Havohej pull it off in a great way, but a lot of guys (Glen Benton being a notable example) just sound like angsty teenagers. Just being against something doesn't get you very far.



Says who? God? I'd say it depends on a lot of different factors.



I would also like to hear more artists voice their opinions on Islam.

I don't really agree with your point about it being hypocritical to focus on a single religion. Christianity is a nuisance to me and Islam may even become a real threat in the near future, but Hinduism or Buddhism, for example, never affected my life in any way.

EDIT: Added some more insights into the issue.

Burning a church gets them sympathy -> Jews in Holocaust. They'd have succeeded in wiping them out if they tried being nice, hence complete assimilation. Mock the fools, make them look silly, lose credibility, then support drops.

And all religions that call for reliance on a all-powerful being are tarred w/ the same brush. You wouldn't want to live under an orthodox Jewish state, I'm sure -> stoned aldulterers (haw haw), death penalty for working on sabbath, etc

Those don't sound like bad rules to me...

i think adultery would be any kind of sex outside of marriage though

Yes. Judaism's closer to Sharia than it is to Christianity.

Edit: and when I say work, I don't mean at the office. There's a thing called 'melacha', which is basically any of the different activities done when building the Tabernacle in the desert. So, light a fire, plough a field, dye cloth, crush wheat, and you're in for it. PLUS the orthodox interpret them to fit in with modern life, so they don't turn lights on (=lighting a fire), drag a bench in soil (=ploughing) for example. The Talmud discusses it all, in increasingly bewildering levels of depth - some spend a lifetime on it. Two point something years was enough for me, mad shit.

I've read the old testament, and i sure wouldn't want to live in a society like that. Not being able to light a fire on sabbath would really suck for a smoker like me. I agree that all middle-eastern monotheism is pretty much the same in essence. My point about Hinduism, Buddhism etc. still stands, though.

Perhaps carpet bombing everything south and east of Turkey would help.

I'd add most of the Eastern half of Turkey to that. Our whole west is basically living as a part of Europe culturally, but there are some that would dare to put secularism into question. Carpet bomb to all!

Plus, Israel's quite possibly the one place I'd advocate nuking (after evacuation, of course). They wouldn't want to live there so much if it was a radioactive wasteland.

Now where's the fun in that? But yeah, eliminating Israel would make pretty much everyone happier. Except for the Zionists.

They can go live in America with their rich cousins. Jordan could swallow the Palestinians easy.

And people complain here about immigration

I say lets all live in peace and forget the killing and the hatred, the world is full of it already.
As for burning churches and mosques, I dont see any point in it. Just let people worship whatever they believe in (be it God, Buddha etc) without having to live in fear. I dont see the point these extremists are making.

Well those are good thoughts, nobody would want war but sometimes it's necessary. Turkey's on the brink of entering Iraq for terrorism, they say they can retaliate, a war seems even though a bit unlikely, possible. America is also frowning upon it.


Now do we sit back and take it, 2 to 10 people dying on terrorist attacks every day, or do we attack? As a peaceful person that I am, I say we do. Sometimes you have to make war to achieve peace, it's just the way of life. I'm old enough to join the army, and if I didn't go to college I would be happy to sign in for this mission. War is sometimes necessary. Period.