Metal Reviews

The concept is the same, though. It's not very different at all. You're seeing a very small part of who I am and making a judgement.

"You"? And it is different, as that's all that there is to see, short of actually going out to the US and visiting you.

Would you be able to say the same thing if they blew up your mother?

I like to think so. If a black man saved DEA's life, would she change her opinion of them? :roll: Stupid question.

Not YOU, obviously. But is it so different if DEAs only contact with black people is the same?: harassment. Trust, it's not hard to imagine that she is constantly harassed by blacks in that manner. I've seen it, I've lived it.

You get harassed by blacks too? Yes, I can see where she's coming from.

To prejudge based in the race is wrong. All is a matter of culture, not of race. You can judge someone for his way of acting, for his beliefs, but not by the colour of their skin. That's a fact, and that's the reason why Eyesore can affirm that black man are different in USA and UK.

And I'm sure that an afroamerican engineer or doctor is no way equal to a afroamerican gangsta. Cultural fact, of course.

You guys post faster than I can keep up with it all!

Zad:
Where I live, the majority of blacks are just like everyone else. It's the whites that are the problem here. Ever heard of "chavs"? Doubtlessly we should visit each other's neighbourhood, just to see what things can be like...

I've heard of chavs. We have them here, too, only we call them wiggers. You don't have the problem with blacks that we have, though, because you don't have as many. The black culture makes its way to Europe, but fortunately for you guys, the negros don't go with it.
Here, blacks also like to concentrate in certain areas and when you get a lot of blacks together, they're more likely to cause trouble than if you just have one black in the midst of a bunch of whites. That's why in the US, the single best indicator of a city's crime rate is how "dark" the population is. Detroit, Chicago, Washington DC...high crime rates and majority black populations. The best cities in the US to live in are always predominately white cities. That's why my old city was consistently ranked in the top 3 of best places to live in America. And that's why Detroit will never be on that list.

That's different. They're judging you from your online persona, which may or may not be different from how you are in reality. Me, for example, I'm actually quite nice off-line.

How is judging someone by their online persona much different than judging a stranger based on the way he dresses, speaks, and carries himself?

That's what I was saying, Ken, yes. Still disagree with the thinking, I mean, I don't go around despising all Muslims because a few blew themselves up in London...

Well, that would be silly. But maybe you could despise all Muslims because they hold values with which you disagree. You might despise them for the way they keep women subservient or for any number of reasons.
I don't just despise blacks because of what they do to me. I despise them because I disagree with their culture and values. I refuse to support their kind of lifestyle.

I like to think so. If a black man saved DEA's life, would she change her opinion of them? :roll: Stupid question.

I've based my opinion of blacks on the majority that I've encountered. One individual acting otherwise would not change my opinion of them because I did not form my opinion based on only one person. I think it's great if a black person can step outside the black stereotype and actually be a productive member of society, but I'm not going to praise all blacks because of the few who aren't like the others.

Of course I despise a culture that opresses women and glorifies suicide bombers. It doesn't mean that I have to hate everyone with a connection to that culture. I don't support that culture, but I have met people who are good in spite of that.



As I said, online personas are something completely different. If we were all sat around in a big room talking, but seperated visually, we'd all act much differently than online.

So if the majority of Americans that I've met were selfish, ignorant, arrogant idiots, it's fine for me to feel that way about Americans in general?

Zad-

If you don't support the culture, why would you want to associate with people who do support that culture? I know I usually prefer to spend time with people who share my values, rather than oppose them.

If you think the majority of Americans are "selfish, ignorant, arrogant idiots" and you decided because of that you preferred not to associate with them...well, I'd understand. And you'd be within your rights to do that. If any American wanted to befriend you, then it wold be up to them to prove that they are not like other Americans.

My response:


Sorry for the Myspace-ocity, I didn't feel like messing around with the timer.

There is a very valid, practical point to what you said. When I go to Springfield, especially to the bus station (Ken knows what I'm talking about) I'm always very, very aware of what's going on around me, and I admit, I do my best to look like someone you don't want to mess with. Hell, I think of how I dress (boots, black pants and band t-shirts) as armor of a sort, although against antagonists in general. However, there's a difference between being careful in a dangerous area of town and believing that someone automatically has a certain set of traits because of their race. The whole world does not conform to your little corner of it.

As for Jews, most Europeans countries didn't allow Jews to hold land back in the middle ages, so most became bankers and businessmen...and lo and behold, they became richer than their dirtfarming Christian countrymen. Thus, the stereotype of the greedy, moneylending Jew. Oh, and they ate Christian babies, too, in case you ever wondered what REALLY goes on in a synagogue. (Catholics are always a little gamey, though. :twisted: )

I have a hard time with religion. Having lived life as a devout Christian for most of my life, my family converted to Orthodox Judaism in my early teens. I'm still extricating myself, and having an insider viewpoint makes me take things differently. Although many Jews are idiots, many are not. Do I support the religion? Not any more. Do I like conservatives? Not my politics, but I can be friends with them. Same with Muslims. If everyone I knew shared my values to the T, then things would be rather boring, no?

As for Los Americanos, I know that not all of you are like that. The majority I've met are, though. I choose to give 'em more of a chance. Different circumstances to yours, obviously.

Edit: and :o and @ Kayla. That fringe does not suit you, although there's nothing wrong with the rest of you, as I said.

But you can't say for sure.

Let me tell you a story. In 1996 I got stationed in Little Rock, Arkansas. My suite-mate (the guy who shared the bathroom with me) was from Memphis. He was raised a racist. He had racist tattoos on his body, but by the time I met him he was questioning his beliefs. He joined the Air Force under the whole White is Right, White is Might pretense, but he wasn't too stupid to realize that all these people of different cultures that he was meeting simply weren't like he was taught they were.

He was a fairly skinny guy, he taught Combat Arms so he was outside a lot in the Arkansas heat and he often found himself dehydrated. One day he was extremelely dehydrated (it's fucking hot down there) and he collapsed in his room. Luckily his door was open. A Mexican cop he didn't know happened to walk by, this Mexican saw him in his room, got him breathing again, called an ambulance, went to the hospital with him and stayed with him for 12 fucking hours!! These two had never met before. This Mexican, a person he was raised to hate, saved his life. And that's two-fold. They became great friends, we all did. Santiago was a fucking cool motherfucker!

I saw the evolution of my friend, I saw him as he struggled with it all, as he slowly covered his racist tattoos and became a new person with a new way of thinking. Then Social Distortion, one of his favorite bands, released White Light, White Heat, White Trash and that was what lead him to "rebirth," so to speak. On it there is a song called "I Was Wrong," the lyrics detail Mike Ness' struggle with drug addiction and how he blamed everyone else. This song was THE song of my friend's life, it redefined him. The lyrics were written for a different reason, but are universal. They're about being wrong and blaming others for YOUR mistakes:

Oh, when I was young
I was so full of fear
I hid behind anger, held back the tears
It was me against the world
I was sure that I'd win
But the world fought back, punished me for my sins
I felt so alone
So insecure
I blamed you instead, made sure I was heard
And they tried to warn me
Of my evil ways
But I wouldn't hear what they had to say
I was wrong
Self destruction's got me again
I was wrong
I realize now that I was wrong

And I think about my loves
Well, I've had a few
Well, I'm sorry that I hurt them
Did I hurt you too?
I took what I wanted
Put my heart on the shelf
But how can you love me when you don't love yourself?
It was me against the world
I was sure that I'd win
The world fought back, punished me for my sins
And they tried to warn me
Of my evil ways
But I couldn't hear what they had to say

I was wrong
Self destruction's got me again
I was wrong
I realize now that I was wrong
I was wrong, yeah
I was wrong

I grew up fast
And I grew up hard
Something was wrong from the very start
I was fighting everybody
I was fighting everything
But the only one that I hurt was me
I got society's blood running down my face
Somebody help me get outta this place
How could someone's bad luck last so long?
Until I realized that I was wrong

I was wrong
Self destruction's got me again
I was wrong
I realize now that I was wrong
I was wrong
Self destruction's got me again
I was wrong
The only moment that I was me
I was wrong

In 1999 right before we both went to Korea we went and saw Mike Ness on his solo tour, we hung out after but Mike Ness never came out of his tour bus. I then spoke with his tour manager and she explained that he was still inside, I pulled her aside and kind of gave her a rundown of what I just told you guys above. She went inside, spoke to Mike, and he agreed to see. This motherfucker was so fucking cool! He hung out with us for two fucking hours! We sat and talked about everything from the Air Force to the early days of Social Distortion. My friend thanked Mike for writing that song from the bottom of his heart, because that was song was THE defining moment in his life up to that point. Mike accepted the thanks with heartfelt thanks of his own, for giving him a greater appreciation of the meaning of his words and for serving in the Air Force. It was awesome. To see what that did to my friend and Mike, two totally different people, to see how it all affected both of them was amazing. It was one of the best moments of my life.

So, Zad, to answer your question and discredit your silly little smiley, people can, in fact, change. I have seen it first hand from a tried and true racist, a hateful man. Yes, people can change. Would DEA change? No idea, but I think you guys aren't listening to her enough to realize that she's really not a hateful person.

You misunderstood the smiley, it was directed at you and your daft example. How many more times must I say it - she has a valid point, now that I've heard her out and am not merely reacting to phrases like "black men like to rape women" and "I don't like Jews or Mexicans".

I can agree with many of DEA viewpoints, but as someone else said, it's a culture thing rather than a race thing. Where I live, the blacks I come into contact with are refugees who deal drugs, but I don't hate every black person. I think DEA has some justified fear of blacks, but calling it racism isn't true. So from now on I'm gonna stop thinking of DEA as a racist.

Zad, that picture was from a german school book... disgusting, innit? And Ken, most stereotypes are based on fact, but some facts maybe be not true anymore, or exaggarated from the beginning. Also many peoples are driven to do what we percieve as bad because we don't or didn't let them live decent lives out of fear because they were different.

CU-
I already knew what you looked like. And we look nothing alike. My point stands.

Now, when you say you dress in a way that makes you look like someone not to mess with...well, you are more suited to that. Probably you can wear "tough" clothes and people won't think it's some sort of facade. If I wear clothes like that, people just laugh at me. :? I have some clothes that aren't "pretty" and maybe make me look a little bit like a bad ass...but once I wore them out in public and I still got harrassed. Actually, more so than I did when I wear "pretty" stuff. I can't pull off that look and make it believable. If you can pull it off, probably no one is going to bother you.


Zad-
If you want to be friends with people you disagree with, go right ahead. I guess I have different preferences.

And about what Eyesore said about people changing, I did mention that I wasn't always racist. I also used to be a Christian and I'm not anymore. Really, I'm quite capable of changing. If someday, facts are ever presented to me that prove me wrong about race, then I may change my mind. But I doubt that will happen unless non-whites undergo serious culture changes first.

well, this has quite convinced me, not that i agree with you, but now i can say i can totally understand and tolerate you views on some things. Now contribute to the bloody forum already

Indeedily.



So you're admitting that you're racist now, then? I know what you meant. Just trying to show you the opposite viewpoint, which is done.

Edit:

Yes. Your initiation ritual is complete.

Well, I would love to...been waiting ages for a discussion about a band I like to come up. :p Most of the bands that get talked about on here I don't know of. :(

(Course now Tyrion will probably see this and say I'd know of them if I paid attention to all the stuff he downloads for me and it's my fault for not making more of an effort to remember :oops: )

I think they're completely opposite. With one you're juding them on their image/composure, with the other you're juding them based solely on what theyre saying. Either way I don't think you get an accurate representation of who they are... also I think you're judging them more on their image than their race o.O