Metal Reviews

Burzum is minimalism, which is contributing more than one could say for a number of average power/prog bands. Emperor's song structures are on a whole other level than the vast majority of metal bands from any genre.

But it doesn't matter anyway!

The 'music theory makes me better' argument is trash. I'm waiting for Adveser's treatise on Stravinsky any day now.

Well, first he has to consult the library and, perhaps, his numerous musician friends for verification, so it may be a coupla days...

Not to jump on the bandwagon, but I can say that learning music theory might even diminish ones ability to appreciate music. You start looking too technically, and always try to find mistakes and formulate ideas about what the plan is behind the music.

I try to look as amateurishly as I can to music. I want my jaw dropped when I listen, not criticize constantly.

I disagree. That's not what theory's about at all.

However, some of the best musicians don't know a single thing about music theory, and it's still mad stupid to try and argue that people can't appreciate music if they don't know it.

Take Ulver - Nattens Madrigal. It is the perfect example of what black metal is really about.

Raw, not exactly technical, yet it is as moving as any piece of classical music.
Both are powerful and creative in their own way; one is primal and evokes the "wolf in man" while the other is cerebral and exalting in it's loftiness. By which I mean to say, I derive as much pleasure from Rachmaninoff's 2nd Concerto as I do Ulver's Nattens Madrigal. Both are incredibly moving pieces of music, though diametrically opposed in technique, inspiration and conveyance.
Judging music based on how well it is engineered and mixed, how technical it is or how stringently it adheres to a set principle is missing the point entirely.

CC does not work in humans at all in the manner I described. CC has to do with an automatic unconscious reactions. When human being stop at a red light it is because there is a concern for your own safety, not because red means stop.

It's called an allegory, anyone that's even casually studied the Pavlov dog would know I wasn't being literal. I do think that it is similar to an automatic fear based reaction when people feel threatened.

I've been told on numerous occasions by a variety of people with experience in the matter that at least half of the people are going to talk a bunch of trash because they absolutely loathe what they don't have themselves. See "music critics" and "punk rock" (not on this site, mind you, I'm talking about those rolling stones idiots that bash anything they couldn't record themselves if they attempted it.

What do I have to gain by impressing anyone here, seriously? Nothing. I'm a mechanical linear thinker that is obsessed with details and nothing more. Do you you people really think my posts are about you? I have high standards. Half-assed doesn't cut it in my world, whether it's an album or a simple message board post.

By that logic knowledge doesn't make you more informed. Music is a language. I don't see a lot of you reading books written for a three year old. That is because the vast majority of us were coerced into learning our language to the extent that we are bonafide virtuosos compared to a few hundred years ago.

Think of it this way. If you took French in high school, you sound impressive to your friends that barely understand it themselves when you are a cut above the rest in the class. But you have absolutely no business writing a novel in the language. The French would find the person's grasp of French laughable in any context.

That is why I listen to metal. It has the lowest ratio of "dumb entertainment" to artistry.

I'm not bashing the genres because I like them all really. That's a straw man argument. Also: Hard to play does not mean technical. Very easy to play can be very very technical.

Everything you just wrote smacks of technique and production uber alles, artistic expression be damned.

Again, my original question: why even post in this thread if you are clearly not "mentally" pre-disposed (oh, I realize you incorrectly think you are logically "above it all", but that is not what I mean), interested in or even inclined towards appreciating this style of music, if not to wax pedantic and myopically reduce the genre to "bullshit"?

The fact that you call Akercocke black metal is indicative of the fact that you seem to be not really clued in to what this style of music is, or what it represents.

I'm sorry, My copy of ROTBN must have been switched with a black metal record.

You are stating my opinion which is different than my actual opinion. I love Crionics first two records which are thrashy black metal.

If you want to get into an argument that only tr00 kvlt black metal counts, then I think that is just misguided at best.

I didn't say that was what MT is about. Learning music theory made me look more critically to music, which took some of the fun out of it. It may have different effects on other people.

I think ear training is essential, but nothing else is for the non musician. If you can't perceive the mood and tonality of a song you are missing half the picture.

I mean people really think Eb is the same as E but a little heavier. Listening to an ear training course will make it very apparent that those are not even the same songs anymore once shifted down a half step. The pitches are a half step off, but the unique tones of the individual notes are totally different. Too many people hear in black and white and everyone has the ability to learn the way the notes sound. This is because the notes are all off-key except for A harmonically. That is why the chords have that crunch and ring to them we all love so much.

Uninformed shit like that is what gets on my nerves, especially when people want to argue the point despite most musicians knowing the difference. Just because Metallica can't hear it doesn't mean it isn't there. Hell, the might be aware of it and did it anyway cause they are sick of the songs and it feels like a different song.

Dude, NOBODY CARES!
Erudition and self-stroking pedantry is what gets on my nerves.
If it sounds good who the fuck gives a damn about all that stuff you just wrote?
Like I said, you just want to wax pedantic in another vain attempt at showing off what bit of musical knowledge you have picked up somehow. Bravo, sir. You re clearly a musical wizard, thank you for bestowing the light of knowledge 'pon us, the great unwashed that listen to music mainly for pleasure.
Maybe you can read a book about how most people don't generally suck the life out of music by analyzing and dissecting it into sterile, meaningless pieces.
It's fucking metal, who cares if it is slightly short of perfection? And not everyone cares about the difference between Eb or E.

Coupla things.
The album of which you speak is about as black metal as Morbid Angel.
It's glorified death metal. You don't know what you're talking about, and this is a topic in which I will chew you up and spit you back out on.
If you can't tell the difference between death metal and black metal, leave the fucking hall.

Second, I find that the only ones that still insist on tossing those tired and threadbare phrases "tr00 and kvlt" as some form of dirisive argument are generally the lost and clueless in regards to the genre.

Third, you never answered the question:
why post in a thread about a topic in which you are obviously ignorant of, are pre-disposed to an inability to appreciate and are unable to judge by the appropriate criteria?

This is a straw man. Music cannot be reduced to numbers and values: it has real emotional content. Neither can language be reduced to levels of complexity in this sense. Burzum and Dream Theater are both novels, novels that take radically different paths to achieve similar ends. One relies on minimalism, one relies on technique, and both are designed to appeal to the senses. Which is the more evolved path is a subjective assessment by the listener...many of us like both paths.

Black metal can be trashed for a number of reasons, but it cannot be called dumb entertainment in the popular sense.

And Akercocke, while excellent in my opinion, are far more death than black metal.

I have to disagree with both you and Adveser on your respective points, where Burzum may rely certainly on that level of barebones minimalism, the notes Varg plays registers on a predictable tab and scale and measurable notes and whatnot. Thereby giving some credence to theory or at least basic riff writing, though I agree with Cotb that too much focus on theory turns you into a band like Blotted Science. I don't think any self-respecting metalhead would deny the existence of the quantitative aspect of metal, but when it comes down to it the artistic aspect is reflective in both the technical feats and the aural representation as well.

I should rename this thread "Adveser - the intervention"

Sounds about right.

Fact of the matter is, judging a genre that is primal in nature by standards normally used towards a more technical style (where production is essential) is looking at it all wrong.

A lot of black metal has very atypical, atonal scale progressions, though;
Darkthrone's "En vind av sorg" is a good example.

Salivating when food is brought to you is not even close to equivalent to people feeling threatened on an internet message board.

And humans stop at red lights because of operant conditioning, not classical conditioning.

I took an aural perception class once and did terrible.