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 Post subject: Re: Rob Flynn thinks every metalhead is racist
PostPosted: Fri Feb 05, 2016 11:41 pm 
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Not seen anything about it, although Nile seemed more criticical of Islamic State than Islam in general to me. Then again, Exodus have been doing anti-Islam stuff for a while without any serious censure, no? I think it would take a band on the level of Mastodon to get real mainstream attention.


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 Post subject: Re: Rob Flynn thinks every metalhead is racist
PostPosted: Sat Feb 06, 2016 12:33 am 
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I actually think phil anselmo's "white wine" excuse was to get people to "whine" about what he said....haha


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 Post subject: Re: Rob Flynn thinks every metalhead is racist
PostPosted: Sat Feb 06, 2016 9:40 am 
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North From Here wrote:
While we are talking about taboo subjects, does anyone know of any mainstream press/fallout over Nile being somewhat critical of Islam recently?

I realize this story is a few years old, but it was good to see that Taake's Norwegian Grammy nomination held despite some anger in the Arab media: http://noisecreep.com/taake-anti-islamic/.


Why should being anti- Islam be "taboo"? Anti-christian rhetoric is basically a cliche in the genre. Fuck Islam. Metal being PC is weak and frankly, gay as hell. Since when is this stuff supposed to be a safe space for the pigeon-hearted? This Flynn dude clutching at his pearls over some shit Anselmo said is soft. Anselmo should have just said "yeah, I said it. So what?" Just once I'd like to see one of these guys not blubber out a lame apology in the pathetic attempt at being accepted by the herd.

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 Post subject: Re: Rob Flynn thinks every metalhead is racist
PostPosted: Sat Feb 06, 2016 11:07 am 
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cry of the banshee wrote:
North From Here wrote:
While we are talking about taboo subjects, does anyone know of any mainstream press/fallout over Nile being somewhat critical of Islam recently?

I realize this story is a few years old, but it was good to see that Taake's Norwegian Grammy nomination held despite some anger in the Arab media: http://noisecreep.com/taake-anti-islamic/.


Why should being anti-Islam be "taboo"? Anti-christian rhetoric is basically a cliche in the genre. Fuck Islam. Metal being PC is weak and frankly, gay as hell. Since when is this stuff supposed to be a safe space for the pigeon-hearted? This Flynn dude clutching at his pearls over some shit Anselmo said is soft. Anselmo should have just said "yeah, I said it. So what?" Just once I'd like to see one of these guys not blubber out a lame apology in the pathetic attempt at being accepted by the herd.

I don't think Flynn was out of line for calling Phil on that bullshit, piss weak though his response may be. As an American and a former soldier, it irritates me to no end to see a bunch of backwoods retards throwing up the Hitler salute as some show of white solidarity while being completely oblivious to the fact that they are honoring the culture of one our greatest enemies. Thousands of our boys (as well as our British allies) died to purge the world of those fucking sadists and these dumbasses are acting like it's this great 'fuck-you' to the PC crowd. Get an education and learn to express your opinions like a civilized human and not an ignorant scumbag.

That said, I strongly agree that metal culture should not be constrained by the ebb and flow of the status quo. Individualism has always been championed as one of the genre's most important core values and extreme opinions are bound to exist among this type of people. Racist or not, Anselmo should just damn the consequences and be himself regardless of other peoples' opinions. This is who I am, you can either take me or leave me. Totally up-front and brutally honest. It's up to the listener/fan to decide whether to support your music or not.

And yes, Islam (or any other religion) is definitely not beyond scrutiny. Valid criticism is not racism/nationalism/whatever-ism.

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 Post subject: Re: Rob Flynn thinks every metalhead is racist
PostPosted: Sat Feb 06, 2016 11:20 pm 
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Thrash til' Deth wrote:
cry of the banshee wrote:
North From Here wrote:
While we are talking about taboo subjects, does anyone know of any mainstream press/fallout over Nile being somewhat critical of Islam recently?

I realize this story is a few years old, but it was good to see that Taake's Norwegian Grammy nomination held despite some anger in the Arab media: http://noisecreep.com/taake-anti-islamic/.


Why should being anti-Islam be "taboo"? Anti-christian rhetoric is basically a cliche in the genre. Fuck Islam. Metal being PC is weak and frankly, gay as hell. Since when is this stuff supposed to be a safe space for the pigeon-hearted? This Flynn dude clutching at his pearls over some shit Anselmo said is soft. Anselmo should have just said "yeah, I said it. So what?" Just once I'd like to see one of these guys not blubber out a lame apology in the pathetic attempt at being accepted by the herd.

I don't think Flynn was out of line for calling Phil on that bullshit, piss weak though his response may be. As an American and a former soldier, it irritates me to no end to see a bunch of backwoods retards throwing up the Hitler salute as some show of white solidarity while being completely oblivious to the fact that they are honoring the culture of one our greatest enemies. Thousands of our boys (as well as our British allies) died to purge the world of those fucking sadists and these dumbasses are acting like it's this great 'fuck-you' to the PC crowd. Get an education and learn to express your opinions like a civilized human and not an ignorant scumbag.

That said, I strongly agree that metal culture should not be constrained by the ebb and flow of the status quo. Individualism has always been championed as one of the genre's most important core values and extreme opinions are bound to exist among this type of people. Racist or not, Anselmo should just damn the consequences and be himself regardless of other peoples' opinions. This is who I am, you can either take me or leave me. Totally up-front and brutally honest. It's up to the listener/fan to decide whether to support your music or not.

And yes, Islam (or any other religion) is definitely not beyond scrutiny. Valid criticism is not racism/nationalism/whatever-ism.


Quote:
Thousands of our boys (as well as our British allies) died to purge the world of those fucking sadists and these dumbasses are acting like it's this great 'fuck-you' to the PC crowd.


This is true, but I never looked at WWII through a "good guys vs bad guys" lens; we may have purged the world of a certain group of sadists, but we were also allied with another group of sadists, allowing them to roll their tanks and boots over half of Europe, and it could be argued that that was a pretty bleak period of time for said countries.
But, anyway, that's a whole other topic.
As for Anselmo, well, I think it's safe to say he'll never be a finalist on Jeopardy!... or even Wheel of Fortune, for that matter.
As to the whole "White power" thing... maybe due to the fact that when I was growing up and metal was just coming around, it was a much more exclusive (White, long-haired and denim and leather wearing) sub-culture than it is today. It was lower working class, which meant we grew up in shittier neighborhoods, where blacks and whites did NOT mix, let alone get along. My old man and most of my friends' fathers rode chopped Harleys, and with that comes a certain attitude regarding race relations. Tattoos like "SWP" and "White power" were not uncommon, along with the usual grim reapers, skulls, etc. and nobody really thought twice about it. Funny thing was, nobody thought Hitler was "cool" or any of that shit. So maybe being from that generation and that particular sub-culture has desensitized me to these things, or maybe metalheads today aren't cut from the same rough cloth as the ones of yesteryear. Either way, Anselmo grovelling like that douche Dog- the Bounty Hunter was just sad.

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 Post subject: Re: Rob Flynn thinks every metalhead is racist
PostPosted: Sun Feb 07, 2016 10:37 pm 
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maybe rob flynn will pull a macklemore white privilege and write a song about how tons of his fans are racist


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 Post subject: Re: Rob Flynn thinks every metalhead is racist
PostPosted: Mon Feb 08, 2016 5:41 am 
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cry of the banshee wrote:
As to the whole "White power" thing... maybe due to the fact that when I was growing up and metal was just coming around, it was a much more exclusive (White, long-haired and denim and leather wearing) sub-culture than it is today. It was lower working class, which meant we grew up in shittier neighborhoods, where blacks and whites did NOT mix, let alone get along. My old man and most of my friends' fathers rode chopped Harleys, and with that comes a certain attitude regarding race relations. Tattoos like "SWP" and "White power" were not uncommon, along with the usual grim reapers, skulls, etc. and nobody really thought twice about it. Funny thing was, nobody thought Hitler was "cool" or any of that shit. So maybe being from that generation and that particular sub-culture has desensitized me to these things, or maybe metalheads today aren't cut from the same rough cloth as the ones of yesteryear.

I understand where you're coming from. I'm the same way with the confederate flag issue. Grew up in a rural community with mostly lower income white people and seeing the S&B flying on the backs of trucks was a very common sight. Nobody ever thought of it as racist, just reflective of southern pride and heritage. Seeing the flag within the context of history changed my opinion to a certain extent, but I still remain relatively desensitized to the current outrage circling around it.

But there's just an honest repulsion that sets deep in my gut when I see a guy throwing up the Hitler salute with honest conviction. It really pisses me off. It feels like they're mocking our generation of men and women who made such a herculean effort to stop that madness.

At any rate, I've never understood this 'proud of being whatever race' shtick to begin with. It's like being proud of being tall. Who cares? Be proud of an actual accomplishment instead of a genealogical attribute.

cry of the banshee wrote:
Either way, Anselmo grovelling like that douche Dog-the Bounty Hunter was just sad.

Agreed. It was pretty shocking for me to see him do that as Phil always seemed too prideful to ever make a humbling statement like that. He should have just owned it, explained his position (regardless of popular opinion) and been done with it.

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 Post subject: Re: Rob Flynn thinks every metalhead is racist
PostPosted: Mon Feb 08, 2016 5:54 am 
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noodles wrote:
maybe rob flynn will pull a macklemore white privilege and write a song about how tons of his fans are racist

Read the lyrics to that song and it made me laugh out loud. I would trash all my Vio-Lence records if Flynn ever wrote anything remotely that spineless.

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 Post subject: Re: Rob Flynn thinks every metalhead is racist
PostPosted: Mon Feb 08, 2016 6:33 am 
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Thrash til' Deth wrote:
cry of the banshee wrote:
As to the whole "White power" thing... maybe due to the fact that when I was growing up and metal was just coming around, it was a much more exclusive (White, long-haired and denim and leather wearing) sub-culture than it is today. It was lower working class, which meant we grew up in shittier neighborhoods, where blacks and whites did NOT mix, let alone get along. My old man and most of my friends' fathers rode chopped Harleys, and with that comes a certain attitude regarding race relations. Tattoos like "SWP" and "White power" were not uncommon, along with the usual grim reapers, skulls, etc. and nobody really thought twice about it. Funny thing was, nobody thought Hitler was "cool" or any of that shit. So maybe being from that generation and that particular sub-culture has desensitized me to these things, or maybe metalheads today aren't cut from the same rough cloth as the ones of yesteryear.

I understand where you're coming from. I'm the same way with the confederate flag issue. Grew up in a rural community with mostly lower income white people and seeing the S&B flying on the backs of trucks was a very common sight. Nobody ever thought of it as racist, just reflective of southern pride and heritage. Seeing the flag within the context of history changed my opinion to a certain extent, but I still remain relatively desensitized to the current outrage circling around it.

But there's just an honest repulsion that sets deep in my gut when I see a guy throwing up the Hitler salute with honest conviction. It really pisses me off. It feels like they're mocking our generation of men and women who made such a herculean effort to stop that madness.

At any rate, I've never understood this 'proud of being whatever race' shtick to begin with. It's like being proud of being tall. Who cares? Be proud of an actual accomplishment instead of a genealogical attribute.

cry of the banshee wrote:
Either way, Anselmo grovelling like that douche Dog-the Bounty Hunter was just sad.

Agreed. It was pretty shocking for me to see him do that as Phil always seemed too prideful to ever make a humbling statement like that. He should have just owned it, explained his position (regardless of popular opinion) and been done with it.


Throwing around the sieg heil is for slope-headed retards and paint sniffers.
Tribalism is a universal human thing, though.

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 Post subject: Re: Rob Flynn thinks every metalhead is racist
PostPosted: Mon Feb 08, 2016 6:34 am 
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Thrash til' Deth wrote:
noodles wrote:
maybe rob flynn will pull a macklemore white privilege and write a song about how tons of his fans are racist

Read the lyrics to that song and it made me laugh out loud. I would trash all my Vio-Lence records if Flynn ever wrote anything remotely that spineless.

Yeah, fuck all that "White guilt" garbage.

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 Post subject: Re: Rob Flynn thinks every metalhead is racist
PostPosted: Mon Feb 08, 2016 8:39 pm 
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i was impressed that he has a pretty good grasp of thrift shop's appeal and why it's a problem


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 Post subject: Re: Rob Flynn thinks every metalhead is racist
PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2016 9:19 pm 
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Hellfest, a French metal festival, have lost government funding after refusing to drop Down. They've published an open letter to the loca politicians responsible which is interesting, sounds like the French gov was waiting for an excuse to ditch them:

http://www.metalinsider.net/news/hellfe ... government

Kudos to them for making a stand.


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 Post subject: Re: Rob Flynn thinks every metalhead is racist
PostPosted: Thu Feb 11, 2016 2:49 am 
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Goat wrote:
Hellfest, a French metal festival, have lost government funding after refusing to drop Down. They've published an open letter to the loca politicians responsible which is interesting, sounds like the French gov was waiting for an excuse to ditch them:

http://www.metalinsider.net/news/hellfe ... government

Kudos to them for making a stand.


Je suis Anselmo!

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 Post subject: Re: Rob Flynn thinks every metalhead is racist
PostPosted: Thu Feb 11, 2016 4:22 pm 
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kicking bands off of festivals for doing racist things seems like a bit of a rabbit hole but also i'm probably ok with it


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 Post subject: Re: Rob Flynn thinks every metalhead is racist
PostPosted: Thu Feb 11, 2016 4:58 pm 
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Not a great precedent to set though, the government deciding which metal bands are acceptable?


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 Post subject: Re: Rob Flynn thinks every metalhead is racist
PostPosted: Fri Feb 12, 2016 4:49 am 
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Goat wrote:
Hellfest, a French metal festival, have lost government funding after refusing to drop Down. They've published an open letter to the local politicians responsible which is interesting, sounds like the French gov was waiting for an excuse to ditch them:

http://www.metalinsider.net/news/hellfe ... government

Kudos to them for making a stand.

Indeed. Props to the organizers for standing by a friend, dumbass though he may be, instead of caving to political and social pressures.

Goat wrote:
Not a great precedent to set though, the government deciding which metal bands are acceptable?

Government has been trying to kill the metal for years and has been mostly unsuccessful. Tipper Gore was embarrassed every time she attempted to publicly debate this issue back in the 80's.

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 Post subject: Re: Rob Flynn thinks every metalhead is racist
PostPosted: Fri Feb 12, 2016 6:57 am 
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Thrash til' Deth wrote:
Goat wrote:
Hellfest, a French metal festival, have lost government funding after refusing to drop Down. They've published an open letter to the local politicians responsible which is interesting, sounds like the French gov was waiting for an excuse to ditch them:

http://www.metalinsider.net/news/hellfe ... government

Kudos to them for making a stand.

Indeed. Props to the organizers for standing by a friend, dumbass though he may be, instead of caving to political and social pressures.

Goat wrote:
Not a great precedent to set though, the government deciding which metal bands are acceptable?

Government has been trying to kill the metal for years and has been mostly unsuccessful. Tipper Gore was embarrassed every time she attempted to publicly debate this issue back in the 80's.


I remember the "satanic panic" of the 80s... that scrote Geraldo rode that golden wave of bullshit to big ratings.
They thought Elvis was scandalous back in the day, so some things never change, I guess.

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 Post subject: Re: Rob Flynn thinks every metalhead is racist
PostPosted: Sat Feb 13, 2016 5:00 am 
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Speaking of government attacking metal:

http://www.metalinjection.net/metal-crimes/iranian-musicians-jailed-facing-possible-execution-for-playing-metal

A major 'horns up' to these dudes. Just drives home the point of how fortunate we all are to live in the West where free speech is valued and protected. Hope these guys can get out of that oppressive hellhole of a country and continue making music.

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 Post subject: Re: Rob Flynn thinks every metalhead is racist
PostPosted: Sat Feb 13, 2016 6:45 pm 
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Goat wrote:
Not a great precedent to set though, the government deciding which metal bands are acceptable?

i suppose so, but also whoever gets the job done?

i'm torn


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 Post subject: Re: Rob Flynn thinks every metalhead is racist
PostPosted: Sat Feb 13, 2016 7:40 pm 
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noodles wrote:
Goat wrote:
Not a great precedent to set though, the government deciding which metal bands are acceptable?

i suppose so, but also whoever gets the job done?

i'm torn

I'm not torn at all, sir. Keep government the fuck out of metal!! Let the scene police itself. If you object to a particular person or band on a bill, then don't attend the show and let the promoter/venue know about it. Enough angry voices with full wallets will typically get results, especially nowadays with the power of social media.

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