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PostPosted: Sat May 07, 2011 3:08 am 
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Ist Krieg
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Geriatric Profanity Disorder (GPD) > any and all disorders.


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PostPosted: Sat May 07, 2011 3:22 am 
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traptunderice wrote:
cry of the banshee wrote:
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/us_bin_laden_geronimo;_ylt=ApUBrKXaNrMmYwa0PO0U_MpvaA8F;_ylu=X3oDMTFjdHNjZDk3BHBvcwMzBHNlYwN5bl9wcm9tb3NfdG9wX2JhcgRzbGsDYmFja2xhc2hvdmVy

Jesus H. Christ, is there anything that some minority group isn't offended by?

This is almost as bad as that idiot that claimed the term "black holes" be racis' an' shit.

:lol:
:blink: You don't understand why they would prefer that their national heroes weren't compared to a mass murderer?

+1, noodz.



It was a codename not a comparison. Seriously, the story sounds like something off of The Onion, or some other satire news site. They could have made the code name George Washington, and nobody would have given a shit.

I wish they had used my name for the codename. That would have been cool.


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PostPosted: Sat May 07, 2011 9:32 am 
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Adveser wrote:
Good news. I'm over the conspiracy stuff, so it won't be making any appearances anytime soon. It's amazing how some stuff is like a daily habit that gets dropped immediately when you don't get the mental reward for doing it. I'd rather do something productive.

See, people with severe ADHD that aren't on meds are something of Dopamine junkies. Meaning we go from one stupid menial task to the next for a thrill that will trigger some dopamine. No Dopamine means severe depression and you don't feel any sense of reward or accomplishment for anything.


Welcome to your senses my friend, now just pray for Obozo to release the photos.


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PostPosted: Sat May 07, 2011 7:02 pm 
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Ist Krieg
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Orion wrote:
traptunderice wrote:
cry of the banshee wrote:
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/us_bin_laden_geronimo;_ylt=ApUBrKXaNrMmYwa0PO0U_MpvaA8F;_ylu=X3oDMTFjdHNjZDk3BHBvcwMzBHNlYwN5bl9wcm9tb3NfdG9wX2JhcgRzbGsDYmFja2xhc2hvdmVy

Jesus H. Christ, is there anything that some minority group isn't offended by?

This is almost as bad as that idiot that claimed the term "black holes" be racis' an' shit.

:lol:
:blink: You don't understand why they would prefer that their national heroes weren't compared to a mass murderer?

+1, noodz.



It was a codename not a comparison. Seriously, the story sounds like something off of The Onion, or some other satire news site. They could have made the code name George Washington, and nobody would have given a shit.

I wish they had used my name for the codename. That would have been cool.


Abolutely.
But as you are most likely aware, there is a whole industry dedicated to looking for ways of being offended and outraged.

http://cityhallblog.dallasnews.com/arch ... ns-ra.html

Quote:
Commissioner Kenneth Mayfield, who is white, said it seemed that central collections "has become a black hole" because paperwork reportedly has become lost in the office.
Commissioner John Wiley Price, who is black, interrupted him with a loud "Excuse me!" He then corrected his colleague, saying the office has become a "white hole."
That prompted Judge Thomas Jones, who is black, to demand an apology from Mayfield for his racially insensitive analogy


http://abclocal.go.com/kabc/story?secti ... id=7475737

Quote:
"That was very demeaning to African American women. When it made reference to African American women as whores and at the end, it says 'watch your back,'" said Leon Jenkins of the Los Angeles NAACP.


Fucking idiots.


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PostPosted: Sat May 07, 2011 8:24 pm 
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Ist Krieg
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It’s increasingly clear that the operation was a planned assassination, multiply violating elementary norms of international law. There appears to have been no attempt to apprehend the unarmed victim, as presumably could have been done by 80 commandos facing virtually no opposition—except, they claim, from his wife, who lunged towards them. In societies that profess some respect for law, suspects are apprehended and brought to fair trial. I stress “suspects.” In April 2002, the head of the FBI, Robert Mueller, informed the press that after the most intensive investigation in history, the FBI could say no more than that it “believed” that the plot was hatched in Afghanistan, though implemented in the UAE and Germany. What they only believed in April 2002, they obviously didn’t know 8 months earlier, when Washington dismissed tentative offers by the Taliban (how serious, we do not know, because they were instantly dismissed) to extradite bin Laden if they were presented with evidence—which, as we soon learned, Washington didn’t have. Thus Obama was simply lying when he said, in his White House statement, that “we quickly learned that the 9/11 attacks were carried out by al Qaeda.”

Nothing serious has been provided since. There is much talk of bin Laden’s “confession,” but that is rather like my confession that I won the Boston Marathon. He boasted of what he regarded as a great achievement.

There is also much media discussion of Washington’s anger that Pakistan didn’t turn over bin Laden, though surely elements of the military and security forces were aware of his presence in Abbottabad. Less is said about Pakistani anger that the U.S. invaded their territory to carry out a political assassination. Anti-American fervor is already very high in Pakistan, and these events are likely to exacerbate it. The decision to dump the body at sea is already, predictably, provoking both anger and skepticism in much of the Muslim world.

We might ask ourselves how we would be reacting if Iraqi commandos landed at George W. Bush’s compound, assassinated him, and dumped his body in the Atlantic. Uncontroversially, his crimes vastly exceed bin Laden’s, and he is not a “suspect” but uncontroversially the “decider” who gave the orders to commit the “supreme international crime differing only from other war crimes in that it contains within itself the accumulated evil of the whole” (quoting the Nuremberg Tribunal) for which Nazi criminals were hanged: the hundreds of thousands of deaths, millions of refugees, destruction of much of the country, the bitter sectarian conflict that has now spread to the rest of the region.

There’s more to say about [Cuban airline bomber Orlando] Bosch, who just died peacefully in Florida, including reference to the “Bush doctrine” that societies that harbor terrorists are as guilty as the terrorists themselves and should be treated accordingly. No one seemed to notice that Bush was calling for invasion and destruction of the U.S. and murder of its criminal president.

Same with the name, Operation Geronimo. The imperial mentality is so profound, throughout western society, that no one can perceive that they are glorifying bin Laden by identifying him with courageous resistance against genocidal invaders. It’s like naming our murder weapons after victims of our crimes: Apache, Tomahawk… It’s as if the Luftwaffe were to call its fighter planes “Jew” and “Gypsy.”
There is much more to say, but even the most obvious and elementary facts should provide us with a good deal to think about.

http://www.guernicamag.com/blog/2652/no ... ion_to_os/

hehe


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PostPosted: Sat May 07, 2011 8:41 pm 
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Ist Krieg
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noodles wrote:
Quote:
It’s increasingly clear that the operation was a planned assassination, multiply violating elementary norms of international law. There appears to have been no attempt to apprehend the unarmed victim, as presumably could have been done by 80 commandos facing virtually no opposition—except, they claim, from his wife, who lunged towards them. In societies that profess some respect for law, suspects are apprehended and brought to fair trial. I stress “suspects.” In April 2002, the head of the FBI, Robert Mueller, informed the press that after the most intensive investigation in history, the FBI could say no more than that it “believed” that the plot was hatched in Afghanistan, though implemented in the UAE and Germany. What they only believed in April 2002, they obviously didn’t know 8 months earlier, when Washington dismissed tentative offers by the Taliban (how serious, we do not know, because they were instantly dismissed) to extradite bin Laden if they were presented with evidence—which, as we soon learned, Washington didn’t have. Thus Obama was simply lying when he said, in his White House statement, that “we quickly learned that the 9/11 attacks were carried out by al Qaeda.”

Nothing serious has been provided since. There is much talk of bin Laden’s “confession,” but that is rather like my confession that I won the Boston Marathon. He boasted of what he regarded as a great achievement.

There is also much media discussion of Washington’s anger that Pakistan didn’t turn over bin Laden, though surely elements of the military and security forces were aware of his presence in Abbottabad. Less is said about Pakistani anger that the U.S. invaded their territory to carry out a political assassination. Anti-American fervor is already very high in Pakistan, and these events are likely to exacerbate it. The decision to dump the body at sea is already, predictably, provoking both anger and skepticism in much of the Muslim world.

We might ask ourselves how we would be reacting if Iraqi commandos landed at George W. Bush’s compound, assassinated him, and dumped his body in the Atlantic. Uncontroversially, his crimes vastly exceed bin Laden’s, and he is not a “suspect” but uncontroversially the “decider” who gave the orders to commit the “supreme international crime differing only from other war crimes in that it contains within itself the accumulated evil of the whole” (quoting the Nuremberg Tribunal) for which Nazi criminals were hanged: the hundreds of thousands of deaths, millions of refugees, destruction of much of the country, the bitter sectarian conflict that has now spread to the rest of the region.

There’s more to say about [Cuban airline bomber Orlando] Bosch, who just died peacefully in Florida, including reference to the “Bush doctrine” that societies that harbor terrorists are as guilty as the terrorists themselves and should be treated accordingly. No one seemed to notice that Bush was calling for invasion and destruction of the U.S. and murder of its criminal president.

Same with the name, Operation Geronimo. The imperial mentality is so profound, throughout western society, that no one can perceive that they are glorifying bin Laden by identifying him with courageous resistance against genocidal invaders. It’s like naming our murder weapons after victims of our crimes: Apache, Tomahawk… It’s as if the Luftwaffe were to call its fighter planes “Jew” and “Gypsy.”
There is much more to say, but even the most obvious and elementary facts should provide us with a good deal to think about.

http://www.guernicamag.com/blog/2652/no ... ion_to_os/

hehe


Quote:
We might ask ourselves how we would be reacting if Iraqi commandos landed at George W. Bush’s compound, assassinated him, and dumped his body in the Atlantic. Uncontroversially, his crimes vastly exceed bin Laden’s, and he is not a “suspect” but uncontroversially the “decider” who gave the orders to commit the “supreme international crime differing only from other war crimes in that it contains within itself the accumulated evil of the whole” (quoting the Nuremberg Tribunal) for which Nazi criminals were hanged: the hundreds of thousands of deaths, millions of refugees, destruction of much of the country, the bitter sectarian conflict that has now spread to the rest of the region.


Idiotic.

Proof that intellect =/= intelligence.


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PostPosted: Sat May 07, 2011 9:28 pm 
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I can't get over that graduation card thing. Unbelievable.


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PostPosted: Sat May 07, 2011 10:34 pm 
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Ist Krieg
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cry of the banshee wrote:
Quote:
We might ask ourselves how we would be reacting if Iraqi commandos landed at George W. Bush’s compound, assassinated him, and dumped his body in the Atlantic. Uncontroversially, his crimes vastly exceed bin Laden’s, and he is not a “suspect” but uncontroversially the “decider” who gave the orders to commit the “supreme international crime differing only from other war crimes in that it contains within itself the accumulated evil of the whole” (quoting the Nuremberg Tribunal) for which Nazi criminals were hanged: the hundreds of thousands of deaths, millions of refugees, destruction of much of the country, the bitter sectarian conflict that has now spread to the rest of the region.


Idiotic.

Proof that intellect =/= intelligence.
I don't like Chomsky in the slightest but can you explain how that is so explicitly idiotic because I'm part of the intellectually brainwashed.

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PostPosted: Sat May 07, 2011 10:59 pm 
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traptunderice wrote:
cry of the banshee wrote:
Quote:
We might ask ourselves how we would be reacting if Iraqi commandos landed at George W. Bush’s compound, assassinated him, and dumped his body in the Atlantic. Uncontroversially, his crimes vastly exceed bin Laden’s, and he is not a “suspect” but uncontroversially the “decider” who gave the orders to commit the “supreme international crime differing only from other war crimes in that it contains within itself the accumulated evil of the whole” (quoting the Nuremberg Tribunal) for which Nazi criminals were hanged: the hundreds of thousands of deaths, millions of refugees, destruction of much of the country, the bitter sectarian conflict that has now spread to the rest of the region.


Idiotic.

Proof that intellect =/= intelligence.
I don't like Chomsky in the slightest but can you explain how that is so explicitly idiotic because I'm part of the intellectually brainwashed.


Nope, not this time. I'm not going get into another circle jerk with you. Better things to do than engage in endless bullshit.
If you can't glom onto what is idiotic about what I quoted, than I'd only be wasting my time.

Seriously comparing Bush to OBL / and evoking Hitler is so fucking stupid, that only the most vacuous imbecile would find themselves nodding their head in agreement.
It's pretty self evident, if you ask me.


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PostPosted: Sat May 07, 2011 11:04 pm 
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Why don't you like Chomsky, Trapt? Too anarchist?


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PostPosted: Sat May 07, 2011 11:19 pm 
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cry of the banshee wrote:
traptunderice wrote:
cry of the banshee wrote:
Quote:
We might ask ourselves how we would be reacting if Iraqi commandos landed at George W. Bush’s compound, assassinated him, and dumped his body in the Atlantic. Uncontroversially, his crimes vastly exceed bin Laden’s, and he is not a “suspect” but uncontroversially the “decider” who gave the orders to commit the “supreme international crime differing only from other war crimes in that it contains within itself the accumulated evil of the whole” (quoting the Nuremberg Tribunal) for which Nazi criminals were hanged: the hundreds of thousands of deaths, millions of refugees, destruction of much of the country, the bitter sectarian conflict that has now spread to the rest of the region.


Idiotic.

Proof that intellect =/= intelligence.
I don't like Chomsky in the slightest but can you explain how that is so explicitly idiotic because I'm part of the intellectually brainwashed.


Nope, not this time. I'm not going get into another circle jerk with you. Better things to do than engage in endless bullshit.
If you can't glom onto what is idiotic about what I quoted, than I'd only be wasting my time.

Seriously comparing Bush to OBL / and evoking Hitler is so fucking stupid, that only the most vacuous imbecile would find themselves nodding their head in agreement.
It's pretty self evident, if you ask me.
Ahhh, comparing Bush to a war criminal is what irks you. But he did violate Geneva Conventions, no? I refuse to get into a circle jerk. Just asking for clarification.

Why don't I like Chomsky? Umm he doesn't understand capitalism. I feel like he is very idealistic. He has a very good grasp of issues and is obv intelligent yet he clings to the notion that if all the facts were simply presented to the multitude then they would see through their oppression and resist it. However, that completely ignores the notion of ideology where not even facts stand as evidence but that everything becomes distorted to maintain hegemony. He's a socio-anarchist anyways. Not really all that anarchistic. I think it is what Austin Lunn of Panopticon subscribes to.

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PostPosted: Sat May 07, 2011 11:50 pm 
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cry of the banshee wrote:
Geriatric Profanity Disorder (GPD) > any and all disorders.


I've had this before and I'm not joking.


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PostPosted: Sat May 07, 2011 11:52 pm 
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That analogy is a sketch and sounds like dude trying to be provocative but I think it raises an interesting point: that America would be pissed if another country's special forces came into the US and took someone prisoner or killed them. But that's the first complaint I've heard about America doing it to Pakistan.


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PostPosted: Sun May 08, 2011 12:31 am 
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noodles wrote:
That analogy is a sketch and sounds like dude trying to be provocative but I think it raises an interesting point: that America would be pissed if another country's special forces came into the US and took someone prisoner or killed them. But that's the first complaint I've heard about America doing it to Pakistan.
America's has super sovereignty which gives it +5 on transcending other countries' sovereignty.

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PostPosted: Sun May 08, 2011 2:57 am 
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Bush is a criminal and I state this unequivocally, yet in no way is he comparable to Hitler.


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PostPosted: Sun May 08, 2011 4:20 am 
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Just saw this..

The latest badly government photoshopped picture can be seen below:

http://www.infowars.com/more-fake-photos-emerge-in-bin-laden-farce/

Here is the link to the original article:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1384420/Osama-Bin-Ladens-wife-talks-moving-cave-terror-chief.html

Just look at the comment section there, they are not really fooling anybody it seems. I don't have much experience with photoshop but even i could tell this was a sloppy photoshop/paint job.


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PostPosted: Sun May 08, 2011 4:28 am 
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stevelovesmoonspell wrote:
Bush is a criminal and I state this unequivocally, yet in no way is he comparable to Hitler.


Now, I'm in no way, shape or form a supporter of W (quite the opposite in fact; after Zero, worst president ever... right next to Carter), but I never thought his intentions were malicious.
I never got the impression of cold-heartedness that I got from, say Cheney or Wolfie or Perle. Only impression I really got from W was one of gullibility and zealotry laced with a healthy dose of outright incompetence.

Was the Iraq fiasco a mistake of colossal proportion?

Absolutely. It has been a disaster, on so many levels.

But I always felt that W (ya dummy, ya), guilelessly, was a true believer in that he really thought that the potential for a mushroom cloud over one of our lovely cities was a very real possibility with Saddam in power.

Obviously, that intel turned out to be flawed.

Does that make him a criminal? I don't know. Maybe it does.

Now, his neo-con / PNAC cabinet members, on the other hand... cynical insiders that exploited a tragedy for purposes laid out years before 9/11/01. They are criminals, because they without a doubt had Iraq in their sites since the early 90s.

But comparing Bush to Hitler, or even OBL, is absurd, and cheapens those comparisons, frankly.

But then again, what do I know?
I could be very wrong in my assessment, after all.


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PostPosted: Sun May 08, 2011 8:33 am 
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I think he was far more intelligent than my younger days had deluded me into conceiving. It takes a certain type of furtive individual to use a terrorist attack as a pretense to steal civil liberties, launch two unconstitutional wars, destroy economic safeguards, bring corporate insiders to change laws, destroy Posse Comitatus, and overall enact geopolitical goals under the false notion of the War on Terror. While not intellectually sound in matters of a scholastic nature, he certainly was a wily bastard and his legacy set the precedent for Obozo.


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PostPosted: Sun May 08, 2011 5:01 pm 
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cry of the banshee wrote:
Does that make him a criminal? I don't know. Maybe it does.
Actually, that is not at all what makes him a criminal. What makes him a criminal is that we consented to certain international laws and he violated those. Numerous, numerous times. What did Osama bin Laden do violate international laws. One may be malicious, the other a puppet for the corporate interests he solidified through cabinet appoitnments yet that malice has not resulted in nearly a comparable amount of destruction to the bumbling wars of Bush. If we write Bush off as simply being manipulated by his cohorts, then why can't we write bin Laden off as a misguided zealot. Misguided zealots are almost more forgivable than the person who is the leader of the free world who let's his inner circle manipulate him. I don't know if Bush should be compared to bin Laden but I don't think Chomsky's claim was as inane as you claimed it to be.

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PostPosted: Sun May 08, 2011 7:50 pm 
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traptunderice wrote:
cry of the banshee wrote:
Does that make him a criminal? I don't know. Maybe it does.
Actually, that is not at all what makes him a criminal. What makes him a criminal is that we consented to certain international laws and he violated those. Numerous, numerous times. What did Osama bin Laden do violate international laws. One may be malicious, the other a puppet for the corporate interests he solidified through cabinet appoitnments yet that malice has not resulted in nearly a comparable amount of destruction to the bumbling wars of Bush. If we write Bush off as simply being manipulated by his cohorts, then why can't we write bin Laden off as a misguided zealot. Misguided zealots are almost more forgivable than the person who is the leader of the free world who let's his inner circle manipulate him. I don't know if Bush should be compared to bin Laden but I don't think Chomsky's claim was as inane as you claimed it to be.


Well, don't hold your breath waiting for me to defend W or the Iraq invasion, because it ain't gonna happen.

But...

Without going into the dynamics that led to the Iraq invasion (I am not going to defend the indefensible. On the other hand, the day that Saddam Hussein took power, a clash between Iraq and the US was almost inevitable, given the dictators penchant for invading other countries in the region and our vetted interest there), there is a huge difference between deliberately sneak-attacking and killing civilians going about their daily business and launching a war, which based on previous conditions and circumstances, leaves too many grey areas.

The Iraq war was not an intentional attack on the civilian population.
9/11 was.

Beyond that, I can see how the distinctions can get a little blurry, but I just don't see the equivalency.


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