Metal Reviews

then why were you(or still are) in a jazz band?

And I still claim that finished-productwise metal is the most diverse music. And I really don't care what genry is more diverse in other areas or behind the scenes, because to me only the final product matters in this case.

That's easy, man, the legendary made up cybergrind band Electric Fence Enema play all their music on electric toothbrushes and dulcimers.

to WiC:
whatever.... :roll: I know your this kind of guy who never admits he was wong... :roll:

so you don't like Jazz ? good for you ? why do you even bother writing in a topic about Jazz then ? :?

to lizardtail :
does those bands even exist ? :shock:

not everyone is suited to play his favorite genre. one of my best friends is a guy who listened to metal since he was in basic school together with me but his band plays a bit old school rock. does this mean he's not into metal? and so what if TIE was in a jazz band, it still beats being a rapstar doesn't it? :roll:

Of course not! 8)

so shut the fuck up Kiddo !

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not at all, I admit I am wrong when I am wrong. But what exactly was I wrong about here?

BTW, check out the band In Extremo and see what instruments they use.

IN Extremo suxxxxxx :evil: that's terrible crap ! :evil:

and you were wrong saying metal was more diverse that jazz, but you'll never admit it so let just leave it here... :roll:

Well I am hoping to be a professional jazz musician in the very near future, but I still prefer listening to metal. Take a simple allegory. A football player may love playing football, and this is the most important thing in his life, but as soon as he is off the football pitch he prefers to watch basketball, and this interest takes up much of his free time. So no, I will not go and join a jazz forum. :roll:

Bottom line is: diversity is not one of metals strong points, but this does not mean we cannot love it. And anyone... ie WiC... who thinks jazz is less diverse, clearly knows nothng about jazz. Now, clearly there's nothing wrong with not knowing about jazz at all, but we do have a problem if the person then attempts to pass innacurate judgement on it.

Good day to you, WiC. You suck!

Which In Extremo album sucks? I have Verehrt und Angespien and it is pretty good. Would take them over any jazz.

I was wrong? You were talking about instruments diversity I was talking about overall sound diversity, so I don't see how I am wrong.

good luck sitting on subway stations and annoying commuters with your sax in hopes they throw some cash out of pity for you and your jazz.

I have no idea but I guess the first informal sessions would be quite fun to listen to.



This sounds like relentless logic. However, one can even question that. Sometimes the extreme borders of a subgenre can develop so far from the main genre that it is no longer seen as part of it. A Jazz example would be the No Wave/Noise subgenre. The most extreme representatives of this style chucked out every Jazz root and are not considered Jazz anymore but they still fall into the Subgenre. Weird!

However, you are right, you can't compare diversity on different sublevels.
Theory: The looser the definition of a genre is, the more diverse it is. Electronic Dance Music defines it's genres mainly through the beats-per-minutes rate. This is a very precise definition and leaves not much room for diversity. If you are to fast, you are out.
Jazz is defined only through swing, improvisation, intonation, and phrasing. This leaves room for almost everything.
What about BM? I still don't know what the definition is musicalwise. It is more about atmosphere, ideology, lyrics a.s.o. and therefore it could sound like anything, thus it's diverse. Just a theory...

"Jazz is defined only through swing, improvisation, intonation, and phrasing. This leaves room for almost everything".

Weirder still, I don't believe that these factors can be applied to jazz uniformly either.

Swing: A lot of Latin Jazz uses straight quavers instead of swung ones.

Improvisation: A lot of Big Band music features no improvisation.

Intonation: There is no one way in which all jazz musicians intonate.

Phrasing: Read intonation.

I cannot think up one thing which unites all jazz music, which makes your point about subgenre borders all the more pertinent.

Sorry dude, I should have made myself clearer. There is not only one way of intonation and phrasing in Jazz. Opposite, there are as many ways as there are players, and -more important- there are no limits set by esthetic or artistic standards. But intonation/phrasing are important elements to distinguish Jazz from other styles and genres.

And only one of the 4 elements mentioned have to be prominent to define music being Jazz, that's why there is Jazz w/o swing and improvsation.

Just to add my two cents, I can't see metal growing/expanding much in the future. As Stefan said, they (nearly) all use vocals, bass, guitars and drums, and if you listen to metal from the eighties and metal now there's not that much difference. Sure, there are many different MINOR changes, but not as many as Jazz. That's what's good about metal, it doesn't change much. If it did, it would have mutated into something horrible by now that noone cares about, ie metal was saved by death/black coming out of the underground and merging with the commercial stuff to stop nu-metal.

I can see metal declining and fading again in a few years, if this shitecore fad isn't stopped soon, metal will stagnate and get boring like it did in the early 90's.
All IMO, of course.

that was before the internet, when radio stations and MTV were dictating what bands and songs get air time, but with internet it allows for more creativity and people to find bands of various styles without much difficulties, people can easily find out about bands they never knew existed, with internet the floodgates have been opened and metal will never stagnate again.

We'll see...

Has anybody heard the work of Alex Skolnick..? I heard he went into jazz music and Im not sure if he released anything, if he did I might be interested in hearing that.